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A King and Queen Debate Lamb Chops & Goat Meat

A Mother and Father Debate Their Two Sons -- Yaakov & Eisav

1 hr 40 min

Class Summary:

This women's class was presented on Tuesday Parshas Toldos, 28 Cheshvon, 5780, November 26, 2019 at the Ohr Chaim Shul, Monsey, NY.

It is one of those seemingly bizarre and absurd Talmudic tales. The king and queen—they were from the Hasmonaean dynasty, ruling during the Second Temple era—sat and debated which food is preferable, the sheep or the goat. The king said, “Goats are better.” The queen said “No! Sheep are better.” They decided to seek the judgment of the Kohen Gadol, the High Priest of the Temple, because of his familiarity with these animals which regularly served as sacrifices. The High Priest was the man who cooked and consumed the most lamb and goat in the entire Jewish world; he would be the expert.

They summoned the Kohen Kadol, Named Yissachar, who came from the town of Barkaei. He insolently waved his hand in a gesture that demonstrated disdain to the king. How can the king even consider such a foolish idea that goat meat was superior, said the High Priest, when the daily communal sacrifice was brought from sheep? Yissachar was arguing, if lamb was not superior to goat meat, why would G-d ask for a daily feast of lamb, rather than goat?

The king was furious at the insult and the denigrating wave of the hand. The king declared: Since this man, the High Priest, has no reverence for the king, his right hand should be chopped off, making him unfit to serve at all in the Holy Temple (the Temple service was done primarily with the right hand). The Kohen Gadol bribed the executioner to cut off his left hand instead. When the king found out, he had his remaining hand chopped off as well.

The Talmud then goes on to explain how the High Priest erred. For both the Torah and the Mishnah intimate that, from the Torah perspective, sheep and goats are equal.

What are we to make of this apparently absurd tale? Should we laugh or cry? Is this a humorous tale? A parable? Or a reflection on the monstrous behavior of the monarchs of yore?

And how about the story itself? Do kings and queens have nothing better to do than argue if lamb chaps are superior to goat meat? Anyhow, how can you argue about the taste of a meal? As we say in Hebrew, “Al taam viraich, ain mah lhitvokaich.” You cannot argue objectively about taste or smell.

And what are we to make of the Kohen Gadol’s strange answer? The king and queen were ostensibly arguing about physical taste; how does that get resolved from the daily sacrifice in the Temple? Did the High Priest of Israel really believe that G-d consumed and enjoyed the meat of the offerings?

It was the Maggid of Mezrich, Rabbi Dov Ber, one of the greatest spiritual masters of Judaism, the successor of the Baal Shem Tov, who suggested that this story served also as a parable for life. The debate between the king and the queen about sheep and goat represented the debate between Isaac and Rebecca about their sons Esau and Jacob, in this week’s portion.

Yet, as fate would have it, the student of the Maggid who transcribed this teaching of his master, Rabbi Yaakov Yitzchak Horowitz from the city of Lantzut, Poland, known as the Seer of Lublin, forgot the details. It was he, and the third Lubavitcher Rebbe, the Tzemach Tzedek, Rabbi Menachem Mendel, who suggested what the Maggid might have meant. It provides us with one of the most empowering lessons on educations and leadership in our world today.

Please leave your comment below!

  • D

    Doniel -4 years ago

    The Gemara in Shabbas(77b) says:

    רבי זירא אשכח לרב יהודה דהוה קאי אפיתחא דבי חמוה וחזייה דהוה בדיחא דעתיה ואי בעי מיניה כל חללי עלמא הוה אמר ליה א"ל מ"ט עיזי מסגן ברישא והדר אימרי א"ל כברייתו של עולם דברישא חשוכא והדר נהורא

    Rav Zeiras question seems very similiar to the question of the king and queen. However, here there is an answer to the question. The goat will go ahead of the sheep. This might seem like a contractdiction to the Gemara in Krisus that we were suggesting that they are equal. I thought perhaps that the answer might be that the gemara in shabbas is discussing specifically the question of leadership. Who will go ahead of the flock, meaning who will be the better leader. The answer is the personality of the goat. כברייתו של עולם דברישא חשוכא והדר נהורא. Like Dovid Hamelech that experienced so much darkness but in the end brought out the light within himself will be the one who could lead the flock. The flock that is covered in darkness that needs the light broguht out of them. Although both the Tzadik and The Baal Teshuva have their own unique qualities as mentioned in the shiur when it comes to leadership the goat guides the way for the success of the nation.
    Does the Rabbi have any thoughts?

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  • Anonymous -4 years ago

    Anoy

    The Gemara in Shabbas(77b) says:

     רבי זירא אשכח לרב יהודה דהוה קאי אפיתחא דבי חמוה וחזייה דהוה בדיחא דעתיה ואי בעי מיניה כל חללי עלמא הוה אמר ליה א"ל מ"ט עיזי מסגן ברישא והדר אימרי א"ל כברייתו של עולם דברישא חשוכא והדר נהורא 

    Rav Zeiras question seems very similiar to the question of the king and queen. However, here there is an answer to the question. The goat will go ahead of the sheep. This might seem like a contractdiction to the Gemara in Krisus that we were suggesting that they are equal. I thought perhaps that the answer might be that the gemara in shabbas is discussing specifically the question of leadership. Who will go ahead of the flock, meaning who will be the better leader. The answer is the personality of the goat. כברייתו של עולם דברישא חשוכא והדר נהורא. Like Dovid Hamelech that experienced so much darkness but in the end brought out the light within himself will be the one who could lead the flock. The flock that is covered in darkness that needs the light broguht out of them. Although both the Tzadik and The Baal Teshuva have their own unique qualities as mentioned in the shiur when it comes to leadership the goat guides the way for the success of the nation.

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  • Anonymous -4 years ago

    Amazing! Thank you so much! Tizke lmitsvos.

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  • AL

    aharon leib -4 years ago

    I very much enjoyed your shiur this week.   In support that Yitzchak preferred Esau, or goat meat, we see that Rivka 27:9 asks Yaakov to go fetch 2 young goats because "they have the taste that your father prefers"(Rashi).    שבת שלום !

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  • B

    baila -4 years ago

    great

    Thank you for a most moving and magnificent shiur!  The story and deeper interpretation of the king and Queen was INCREDIBLE!!! 

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Women's Toldos Class

Rabbi YY Jacobson

  • November 26, 2019
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  • 28 Cheshvan 5780
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  • 3333 views

Dedicated by Michael and Liz Muschel in loving memory of Sara ben Reb Yechiel Mechel Muschel, for her Yartzeit on 23 Cheshvan. Born in 1927, she hailed from Veretzki, Czechoslovakia, was sent to Auschwitz in 1944, where her parents were murdered. She survived and went on to become Rebbitzen to a world famous educator, while building a beautiful Jewish family, enjoying Nachas from children, grandchildren and great grandchildren. She also rose to become an acclaimed nursing home administrator, cited by NY State for her honorable ethics and rectitude.

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